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Author: nagrom on January 04 2007 Viewed 10176 times. 12 people liked this blog. You can rate it below if you haven't already.
People who enjoyed reading this: emulsion, astroid, cbit, datathinner, soft, Doron, flies, bsr, GregTArtZ, mixedtape, everamzah, nicknotis
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Interview with Sam Harris, author of "The End of Faith".
Basically a very rational argument for questioning, not religious freedom, but the acceptance of religion in society.
Also, if you scroll down a bit, there's an article about the origins of public school, which I implore everybody to read before sending your kids off to be hammered into cubes.
Anybody who was intrigued by the public school blurb, you may be interested in this book on the subject by John Gatto: link (it's free online) | |
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01/04/07
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celibacyclub
i thought maybe the guy in your blog pic was making big bubbles.
seems to not be the case.
01/04/07
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emulsion
"The End of Faith" and "Letter to a Christian Nation" were two of the most inspiring reads I've had in a while. I feel like at some point people will look back at this point in history (especially US history) as being like some second Dark Ages. Assuming we don't all perish in some global catastrophe before then.
01/05/07
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astroid
i would say this is totally useless, except that i think it's good to raise the visibility of atheism. lots of christians only equate atheism with "godless communism".
but, i don't think it's the best idea to attack faith head on and think that will magically usher in a new age. maybe i'm talking like erasmus here, but i think that the only ground that can be gained at this point in the direction of humanism must be presented to the mass of christians without challenging their faith. there's certainly a mainstream in every religion that make their decisions based more on rationality than on faith. venn diagram with the future in the center.
01/05/07
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astroid
the article on public schools is awesome. wish it were longer and more thorough, maybe comparing the other martial societies and their methods of indoctrination. seems like the eugenics movement of the 20th century influenced education, too.
01/05/07
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everamzah
u guys realize when u speak of atheism this way -you're essentially using it _as a religion_
fucking d-u-h
01/05/07
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everamzah
religion vs. atheism - the next great holy war
more petty... much more petty. do u wanna be part of the petty? don't be part of the petty - LOL
edited: Jan 05 2007
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cbit
astroid said: "but, i don't think it's the best idea to attack faith head on and think that will magically usher in a new age. maybe i'm talking like erasmus here, but i think that the only ground that can be gained at this point in the direction of humanism must be presented to the mass of Christians without challenging their faith. there's certainly a mainstream in every religion that make their decisions based more on rationality than on faith. venn diagram with the future in the center."
there's no need for magic. attacking faith directly won't convert those with strong faith; what it does do though, like nagrom summarised, is attack the idea that religion and faith must be accorded respect above the respect given to other beliefs that have no grounding in reality (eg that the holocaust never happened). The aim is to deactivate the 'forcefield' that religion enjoys in 'free thinking' society, this in turn would bring a powerful shift and remove a lot of religion's power (that's why it's not useless).
I've seen a few debates where sam harris has spoken, he puts his arguments very succinctly, i just ordered his 'letter to a Christian nation'. (oh: i'll recommend 'the god delusion' here again).
edited: Jan 05 2007
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cbit
everamzah: you're making a very common mistake when you describe atheism as a religion. This page explains the mistake better than i can link
If you believe that unicorns do not exist, then may I say that you a member of the "No unicorns" religion? Is it a matter of faith that unicorns do not exist? Can I come along to your non-unicorn church with you tomorrow?
The absence of faith isn't a faith.
This will sound rude: by dismissing the attack on religion as petty you've revealed that you don't understand what's at stake.
edited: Jan 05 2007
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astroid
i can forsee an american future in which all non-christians are rounded up and sent into camps. in a fragmented, weakened US, ie. one that loses a global war of any kind, be it economic or conventional, it'd be quite easy for a christo-fascist organization to consolidate power-the power center of this country is already highly consolidated.
to forestall this, i think the broadest possible coalition should be founded.
01/05/07
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bsr
i can see it the other way round: Atheists round up all the Christians and subject them to 're-adjustment'.
edited: Jan 05 2007
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cbit
Most 'rounding up' in the world so far has been either directly motivated, or facilitated through religious belief.. that's why i think bsr's scenario is unlikely.
edited: Jan 05 2007
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bsr
fanaticism is unhealthy whichever side of the fence you're on, unfortunately most atheists are 100% guilty of this. us apathetic agnostics will sit back and watch the show.
[edit - and it's not been motivated or facilitated by religion, it's motivated and facilitated by greed, blaming religion just gives people a cause to belong to]
01/05/07
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cbit
and it's not been motivated or facilitated by religion, it's motivated and facilitated by greed, blaming religion just gives people a cause to belong to
you're selling religion well short: crucially it's capable of giving people a justification for taking part in an antisocial initiative, that's how it facilitates humanitarian horrors. So while a leader might be responsible for triggering a certain initiative motivated solely by greed, the mob that carries out the plan tends to be motivated by faith.
01/05/07
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bsr
so the prime motivating factor would be the big wig who set it in motion for his own ends yes? for power? thus greed?
edited: Jan 05 2007
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cbit
cbit said: "Most 'rounding up' in the world so far has been either directly motivated, or facilitated through religious belief." can you see what i mean by facilitated through religious belief? (i hope that doesnt sound sarcastic, im being sincere).
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