| StoreTags: new, atheism, god, religion, science
Author: nagrom on January 04 2007
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Interview with Sam Harris, author of "The End of Faith".
Basically a very rational argument for questioning, not religious freedom, but the acceptance of religion in society.
Also, if you scroll down a bit, there's an article about the origins of public school, which I implore everybody to read before sending your kids off to be hammered into cubes.
Anybody who was intrigued by the public school blurb, you may be interested in this book on the subject by John Gatto: link (it's free online)
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edited: Jan 07 2007
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astroid
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" * Need to test beliefs - A conviction that dogmas, ideologies and traditions, whether religious, political or social, must be weighed and tested by each individual and not simply accepted on faith.
* Reason, evidence, scientific method - Commitment to the use of critical reason, factual evidence, and scientific methods of inquiry, rather than faith and mysticism, in seeking solutions to human problems and answers to important human questions.
* Fulfillment, growth, creativity - A primary concern with fulfillment, growth, and creativity for both the individual and humankind in general.
* Search for truth - A constant search for objective truth, with the understanding that new knowledge and experience constantly alter our imperfect perception of it.
* This life - A concern for this life and a commitment to making it meaningful through better understanding of ourselves, our history, our intellectual and artistic achievements, and the outlooks of those who differ from us.
* Ethics - A search for viable individual, social and political principles of ethical conduct, judging them on their ability to enhance human well-being and individual responsibility.
* Building a better world - A conviction that with reason, an open exchange of ideas, good will, and tolerance, progress can be made in building a better world for ourselves and our children."
edited: Jan 07 2007
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astroid
that's the old atheism btw. you wanna delineate how that differs from the new atheism?
dawkins is on that list.
edit: when i was a teen, my dad had lots of great atheist literature lying around, free inquiry, the skeptical inquirer, etc. one day i found the pamplet for secular humanism. i showed it to him and said hey paps this looks pretty cool. he said "that's just another fucking club". haha. grumpy george at his finest. made me a curmudgeon along the way
01/07/07
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cbit
astroid said: "that's the old atheism btw. you wanna delineate how that differs from the new atheism?"
On the face of it it looks like the main difference is that 'new atheism' as i understand it also specifically draws attention to the taboo on criticising religious belief, and aims to erode it. ('new atheism'.. a bit like 'web2.0')
01/07/07
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nagrom
Wikipedia said: "Agnosticism (from the Greek a, meaning "without" and gnosis, "knowledge", translating to unknowable) is the philosophical view that the truth value of certain claims — particularly theological claims regarding metaphysics, afterlife or the existence of God, god(s), or deities — is unknown or (possibly) inherently unknowable. Some agnostics take a stronger view that the concept of a deity is incoherent, thus meaningless and irrelevant to life[citation needed]. "Agnostic" was introduced by Thomas Henry Huxley in 1869 to describe his philosophy. The term agnostic is also used to describe those who are unconvinced or noncommittal about the existence of deities as well as about other matters of religion."
Wikipedia said: "Atheism is the disbelief[1] in the existence of any deities.[2] It is commonly defined as the denial of theism, amounting to the positive assertion that deities do not exist, or as the deliberate rejection of theism.[3][4][5] However, others—including most atheistic philosophers and groups—define atheism as the simple absence of belief in deities[6][7][8] (cf. nontheism), thereby designating many agnostics, and people who have never heard of gods, such as newborn children, as atheists as well.[9][10] In recent years, some atheists have adopted the terms strong and weak atheism to clarify whether they consider their stance one of positive belief (strong atheism) or the mere absence of belief (weak atheism).[11][12][13]
Many self-described atheists share common skeptical concerns regarding supernatural claims, citing a lack of empirical evidence for the existence of deities. Other rationales for atheism range from the philosophical to the social to the historical. Additionally, although atheists tend toward secular philosophies such as humanism, naturalism, and materialism, there is no one ideology or set of behaviors that all atheists adhere to.[14][15]
Although atheists are almost invariably assumed to be irreligious or non-spiritual in Western culture,[16] this does not necessarily hold true for all atheists. Some religious and spiritual beliefs, such as several forms of Buddhism, have been described by outside observers as conforming to the broader, negative definition of atheism due to their lack of any participating deities.[17][18] Atheism is also sometimes equated with antitheism (opposition to theism) or antireligion (opposition to religion), despite most atheists not holding such views."
01/07/07
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nagrom
I call myself agnostic because it doesn't carry the connotations of "atheist" (tactfulness), but I think I'm either a hard agnostic or a weak atheist.
Know we don't know, pretty sure what you believe is so improbable as to be effectively impossible, pretty sure we can't know.
edited: Jan 07 2007
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cbit
theres also:
wikipedia said: "Agnostic atheism is a philosophical doctrine that encompasses both atheism and agnosticism. While the concepts of atheism and agnosticism occasionally overlap, they are distinct: atheism is generally defined as "a condition of being without theistic beliefs" while agnosticism is usually defined as "an absence of knowledge (or any claim of knowledge)". An agnostic may identify as an atheist or a theist in certain circumstances (see Agnostic theism)."
"If a man has failed to find any good reason for believing that there is a God, it is perfectly natural and rational that he should not believe that there is a God; and if so, he is an atheist... if he goes farther, and, after an investigation into the nature and reach of human knowledge, ending in the conclusion that the existence of God is incapable of proof, cease to believe in it on the ground that he cannot know it to be true, he is an agnostic and also an atheist - an agnostic-atheist - an atheist because an agnostic... while, then, it is erroneous to identify agnosticism and atheism, it is equally erroneous so to separate them as if the one were exclusive of the other..." (p.50-51)
that last one's too hard to follow imo. heres a simpler version:
The agnostic atheist, therefore, combines elements of not knowing the existence of God with the unbelief in God.
nagrom: i reckon we're both default Atheists. The Agnostic kind (i think bsr is too ;) )
01/07/07
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Jetsom
cbit, you'll never squeeze me into one of these agnotso atheistbeliever boxes. don't even try it! (btw, I'm not here)
01/07/07
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cbit
you're already in lots of different boxes. one more wont make a difference ;)
01/07/07
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Jetsom
"one more wont make a difference"
exactly!
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nagrom
i'm outside the box.
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astroid
lol
still a teenager though
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nagrom
that's what you think, but you can't be objective because you're inside the box.
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astroid
hahaha!
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astroid
01/07/07
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astroid
now before you curse me for pissing your blog with a grunge youtube and go off to facebook to talk to your internet generation friends, i want you to really reflect on the wisdom of those of us in generation x/y (i'm apparently right on the cusp, which explains both the attitudes and the irony)
I'm the man in the box
buried in my shit
won't you come and save me?
save me.
yeah.
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