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When I first heard about the antivaccination lobby I thought it was some kind of weird intertubes joke. I mean, they were just playing, some kind of "save the whales and polio" joke, right? Right?
Wrong. They are dead serious.
And now it seems Donald Trump and Jenny McCarthy have joined the fray, claiming that vaccines cause autism.
A claim that has been shown to be incorrect.
A super hero team of paranoid new age scam artist homeopathy "remedy" selling pricks, the crappiest hair on tv and an mtv hasbeen, and they cannot even come up with some new meritless claim? What the fuck?
Sorry for ranting, the whole thing just gets me riled up.
And now back to the regular stuff, paper geese, smapples etc. | |
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01/05/08
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everamzah
ps it's david icke who's the lizard man. i ignore him
01/05/08
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cbit
cbit said: " evermzah said: "do u think i'd try to convince any one person laying in a hospital bed not to take their medication? i wouldn't, of COURSE i would encourage them to, if they were my friends."
And that's why your crackpot ideas are dangerous as well as deranged."
oops. i misunderstood.
What if your hospitalised friend was convinced that they didn't need their medication? would you still encourage them to take it?
01/05/08
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everamzah
if my hospitalized friend was convinced he didn't need it, TRUELY believed he didn't need it, i don't expect he'd be in the hospital in the first place. however, let's say for the sake of discussion that he had a change of heart. i'd ask him why he felt that way. it all depends, is he really ready for that? do I feel comfortable with it? i am only responsible for myself, so as a friend i can only support him in his decisions. would i encourage it blindly? of course not, i know better.
01/05/08
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everamzah
let me give u an example. when a certain person whom i consider a friend on this board let it be known that he had cancer, of course i didn't think for a second he shouldn't take the necessary steps to improve his health!!  i did what i do.. i stayed mum on ALL THAT and instead told him that i would send him healing energy one night before sleep. i did that, i experienced it, and for me it was valid. that's MY way. now, did it do any good overall? probably not as much good as a pie, but I honestly believe it was something.
01/05/08
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cbit
'Sending healing energy' is something that we can test the efficacy of. Why is it, do you think, that no test of this kind have showed a significant correlation between 'energy sent' and recovery rate?
01/05/08
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everamzah
Looks like you could be leading me into a text-book examination LOL! Why do I think it is? Because of the scientific instruments, and the measurements taken, are not sophisticated enough. The very science is not sophisticated enough. The scientists do not even realize that a measurement of energy using any physical instrument is itself a by-product of a by-product of a by-product, OR that every time they translate this data they distorted it through their very own perception of it. Or maybe they do by now, they are on their way from what I can see.
01/05/08
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crabster
everamzah: Why would any instruments apart from a calculator be needed to show a correlation between people "sending healing energy" and patient recovery? This might interest you btw: link
Personally, I see the whole "I'll pray for him/her" thing (or whatever term you prefer to use) as a strictly selfish project to make yourself feel better that does not require any actual effort or resources. An effortless, and to be honest, slightly condescending cop-out. However, as long as it doesn't in any way hamper or delay other efforts I don't see much harm coming from it either.
01/05/08
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cbit
everamzah said: "Why do I think it is? Because of the scientific instruments, and the measurements taken, are not sophisticated enough. The very science is not sophisticated enough."
You don't need sophisticated instruments to record recovery rates of patients. Or to set up a double blind test of the efficacy of 'sending energy'. Unless you mean that the effect is so insignificant that we aren't capable of controlling the other variables to a great enough extent to detect it.
What about the hypothesis that making arm-pit farts increases recovery rates?, or that brushing your teeth using your left hand makes you get better faster? we can test for these things too, and the tests will probably show no significant correlations. But rather than conclude that these things probably have no effect, we could raise your objections:
The very science is not sophisticated enough. The scientists do not even realize that a measurement of energy using any physical instrument is itself a by-product of a by-product of a by-product, OR that every time they translate this data they distorted it through their very own perception of it.
The point, which should already be clear, is that you can't cherry pick science. If you want to reject the results that seem to contradict your w/view you'll have to reject the rest of it too. And they you're royally fucked.
01/05/08
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everamzah
i have to really apologize, i feel quite foolish after reading the comments of the blog. i just put donald trump and vaccines together in my mind and one ass of a monkey came to print... it's refreshing to read the stories of the people who are experiencing life with autistic children. i wasn't being sensitive to what you were all talking about and came crashing in through the roof.
that said, i'm sharing my beliefs because i like to, it's fun. and i believe so strongly that having fun is so vital to our lives that i concentrate on what's fun and sometimes, i suppose, it ends up starting with a broken window. now, if that didn't make any sense, i understand. but having fun and being spontaneous by trusting and listening to your creative intuitive self, as well as your intellectual self brings more results to ANY problem (re: challenge) than not trusting and not listening with your intuitive, irrational consciousness.
and you can measure that. you measure it every single second of every single day. every armpit fart you fart, every joke you crack is measured by the very self that you constantly deny.
let me write you something i just read whilst shitting...
"[The intellelect] understands, for example, that clairvoyant material is a part of the personality's overall characteristics, so it is not afraid of perceiving it - and it is able to separate such information confusionfrom present physical sense perception. Orderliness, then, is one of its main characteristics. When it is given only one world view, and only one group of assumptions [rational thinking only, as opposed to irrational, intuitive thinking, for exmaple], its orderly nature causes it to throw out all information that does not fit. It is almost forced to make an ardrly picture, say like a jigsaw puzzle picture, while being denied half of the pieces.
"The intellect is not to blame. It does the best it can under those conditions."
And now he goes into the author's dream:
"Now in your dream, you were quite clearly seeing the threshold between physical reality and the magical dimension in which that physical reality has its source. You were being shown - or showing yourself - the difference in the rules or assumptions between the two. The dog's desire for food led him to walk magically through the door, for the desires of the natural creature are satisfied (pause) with an ease that has nothing to do with your ideas of work. What I am getting at is the introduction of the concepts of a different kind of work - very valuable, vital work that is performed at another level and in a different fashion.
"(9:48.) A prime example, of course, is the "work" done to keep each and every creature aive and breathing, the "work" done to keep the planets in their places, the "work" being done so that tone evolutionist can meditate over his theories."
Seth's basic premise here is that every human is a god couched in creaturehood. That we are all a part of a gestalt of energy, and this plane and physical world is one expression of consciousness, one that we create constantly by commanding every atom and molecule "irrationally," "subconsciouslly" ... this "work" that is done seemingly effortlessly. respect that.
-- Seth, from The Magical Approach
01/05/08
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cbit
and you can measure that. you measure it every single second of every single day. every armpit fart you fart, every joke you crack is measured by the very self that you constantly deny.
You're dodging. How can you justify (provisionally) accepting the majority of the conclusions from mainstream scientific investigation while rejecting the results of those tests that contradict your pet theory?
01/05/08
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bitmarch
whoa. what was this thread about again? anyway, keep going
01/05/08
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tommytom
david icke is the lizard dude all that reptillian stuff is to hot to handle but if you properly look in too the vaccine situation its the real deal,the american gov decided that they would give loads of third world countrys vaccines to keep them "healthy" then after all the vaccines were giving out loads of women became sterile and developed cancer so people became suspicious and the vaccines were analyzed in a lab and low and behold there were female hormones in the vaccines.These hormones were detrimental in the causing of cancer and sterilization in the women,so when the U.N were asked why were the hormones in the vaccines they just said it was a mistake HOW THE FUCK DO U MAKE THIS FATAL MISTAKE IN 130 COUNTRIES WHERE THE VACCINES WERE PRODUCED!
01/05/08
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tommytom
population control
01/05/08
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crabster
Sources please.
01/05/08
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Zanf
What I find interesting in all this debate is the drawn lines of that "if you dont believe in/accept the benefits of vaccinations then you are against science and therefore a heretic and akin to ignorant savages deep in the African jungle". A seeming unswerving belief that all what pharmaceutical companies do is purely for the benefit of the human race and a complete denial of the existance of the Medical Industrial Complex.
So how does everyone feel about HPV vaccination thats being rolled out across western countries with increasing death rates?
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