Electronic Music 411 - gay: genetic or behavioral?

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gay: genetic or behavioral?

StoreTags: gay, homosexual, sociology

Author: datathinner on September 29 2006

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--> lately i've been studying various surveys and experiments and articles about human sexuality. Before Kinsey's studies, this topic was generally regarded as trivial by most social scientists ... but it seems like we (as a society) are still just as confused on the topic as we were 100 years ago. i recently had a discussion with someone about this and it led to nowhere but insults. so i figure i'll try it with smarter people at EM411. the person (he was gay) mistook me for an "ignorant homphobe" because i was straight and I disagreed with him, ugh. i don't hate gay people, and the sad thing was i was on his side until that whole business of me being ignorant ...

so the question is: do you guys think that being gay is (a)genetic or instinctual - inherited through our parents from birth or (b)social - inherited from our social interactions with people and culture?

basically, is it nature or nurture? what's your thoughts?

i'll save my answer for a little later, i'd like to hear y'alls opinion on this.

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Comments

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09/29/06 + race4prize

i'm no scientist but i'd guess it was nature. otherwise a vast amount of children brough up by homosexual couples would be gay right? well...maybe.

i don't have any stats

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09/29/06 + cloudscapes

lots of stuff I guess. maybe part genetics, maybe part social/other influence. one thing for sure though, you can't "cure" someone from being gay. there actually have been studies and thpse who tried out suffered from depression, after thinking they were cured (denial). :

you are what you are. nothing wrong with that

there's a wingnut on another board that's always spraying hard-right/evangelical/homophobe propaganda, we frequently get into arguments with him before we remember we're on the internet :P

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09/29/06 + cbit

WHAT DOES IT MATTER WHERE HOMOSEXUALITY COMES FROM?
Proving people are born gay would give them wider social acceptance and better protection against discrimination, many gay rights advocates argue. In the last decade, as this "biological" argument has gained momentum, polls find Americans - especially young adults - increasingly tolerant of gays and lesbians. And that's exactly what has groups opposed to homosexuality so concerned.

link

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09/29/06 + Roshi

I'm getting irritated by this discussion. Too fucking cerebral and more than a tad insensitive. I feel like I'm a lab rat being discussed here.

All I know is that I knew from a very early age.

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09/29/06 + bsr

i wouldn't label myself either way. and i fucking hate the term bi. cos i don't think i am, i just go with the flow. bi seems to be a phrase emo kids on myspace use to make themselves look cool. and yeah, not particularly down with this discussion but anythings open to debate the fuck out of.

09/29/06 + room

No one is discussing you in person Roshi

The biopsychosocial idea of sexuality I put forward is applicable to all orientations - I'm basically saying whats the point of thinking about people in terms of such simple boxes - we're all so diverse.... I think it is absurd that sexuality should be considered as being the result of one causal element - its about people and how they express their needs - its as individual and different as people are themselves....

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09/29/06 + Roshi

I know that, room. You seem to be pretty cogent about this subject.

However, years of being called "faggot" does not make it easy for me to read the other people who casually toss out "nurture" as their thesis, when they haven't had to deal with the consequences of asshole politicos insisting that some deep part of me is a "lifestyle choice". I don't want to stifle discussion here, but to just point out that someone's casual opinion can have consequences.

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09/29/06 + mlbot

Sexuality is definitely a complex issue, socially and scientifically.
if sexuality were 100% genetic, then identical (monozygotic) twins would, 100% of the time, both be gay, or both be straight. This isn't the case... depending on what type of twins you study (ones rasied in the same house, or identical twins seperated at birth... not very common) only about half the time are twins, who are 100% genetically identical, both homosexual or both heterosexual-- this, of course, can vary depending on how you measure sexuality. For instance, are you a heterosexual male if you have had sex with a woman? This suggests sexuality does have genetic components, but not entirely. Whether the rest is due to society, or due to pre-natal environements (or, i guess, choice) is unclear.

Perhaps the reason people are always thinking you are a homophobe, datathinner, is the way you treat the issue.
You hurl phrases around like 'i dont hate gay people but...' and that's a freaking alarm right there. From your blogs, you seem to regard gay as abnormal. Whether you feel that way, I dunno, but that's sure how you sound.

We have a researcher next door who has recently become a local pariah... he studies sexual orientation in sheep and is finding genetic components very early on. As cbit says, the implication is that if sexuality is something you are, at least in part, born with, then it is not a basis for legal discrimination. Unfortunately, its a two bladed sword. The other implication is that if he finds "gay genes", will these be used to "cure" or identify homosexuals? Anyhow, as a reseacrher he recently wrote a grant to further his studies, in which he wrote that 'if my hypothesis is correct, and genes do contribute to sexuality in my animal model, i should be able to treat pregnant ewes with this drug to block said genes and reduce the number of homosexual progeny" which is fairly standard for a scientist to propose (if x->Y, if I block X I should block Y) but stunk heavily of trying to find a Gay Cure.

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09/29/06 + bsr

sounds like x-men3

09/29/06 + kidko

I think research efforts would be better spent on trying to understand what makes a homophobe and what makes it so hard for some people to accept diversity and find a cure for that.

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edited: Sep 29 2006 + TecknoMan

I'd say part nature and part nurture. I knew I liked girls really young, like 2 or 3. I'd imagine it would be the same for a gay person, but with people of their own gender.

I think it's tough to guess how anybody got anywhere, really.

Re: not accepting diversity -- one big cause of that seems to be growing up in isolation, or in a homogenous place. On the other hand, dwelling in a place like a big city *tends* to make people more accepting/indifferent of people's variations.

edit: Ever notice, for instance, that most liberal types live in urban areas? One big theory is that living shoulder-to-shoulder with all different races/creeds/lifestyles actually points a person in that direction.

09/29/06 + midgetfidget

I'd say that with some people it's genetic, some it's a behavioural thing, some it's a bit of both.

It's all shades of grey for me.

However, I once met this really interesting girl who was doing her phd on pheromones, and her big theory was that gay men emit a pheromone that is closer to a female pheromone than a male one. She reckoned that she'd been smelling these pheromonesfor so long that she could actually tell with her nose who was straight and who was gay. It sounded like a crock of shit to me, but she ended up getting her thesis published.

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09/29/06 + Zanf

For me, this is an abstract about a specific subject.

why is it that some people hate bananas to the point that if they smell one, they gag but love tomatoes? Is that nature or nuture?

why is it that when any discussion of who people could potentially love, it always comes down to the physical act and defining it in very binary terms? If you could love someone despite of their race or age then why should gender suddenly be so important?

A friend of mine who has relationships with both men and women once said: its not about gay or straight, its about being in love.

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09/29/06 + bleen

Zanf said: "A friend of mine who has relationships with both men and women once said: its not about gay or straight, its about being in love."

ding, ding, ding!! we have a winner. it's just too bad that for so many people this isn't what it's all about.

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09/29/06 + bsr

well, some people just want to fuck.

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